The Future of Batman, After the Dark Knight?
Update 7/23 - Goyer talks to the MTV blog and Poison Ivy sequel possibility?
Thanks to the MTV blog we have some more news regarding the continuation of the Batman franchise in a third film with some actual conversations with David Goyer, story writer and screenplay writer for Batman Begins and The Dark Knight.
“I think that’s the scariest thing – to think, could we come up with a third movie that was as good as the first two? Can we top ourselves?” screenwriter David Goyer asked aloud, almost rhetorically, in a recent conversation with MTV News. “Doing it a third time would be a big proposition.”
“We’ve only talked loosely about it, though, Chris and…I have one…but I’m not going to tell you. Chris is very particular about that…I do think, though, that if there’s not a third film – these two movies stand on their own,” he added. “I think it could go either way.”
So where do you go after The Dark Knight? Depending on how you liked the film, how do you “top” yourself? Goyer seems to want to explore more and I think some of the themes we have written about make for an interesting sequel. Also I have heard the talk about doing a Batman movie around the theme of the environment and Poison Ivy playing a role in that. If that happens I will never talk about Batman again the rest of my life! The next Batman movie really needs to be about him again, how the people hate him and how he gets their trust back. It does not need to be about making a political/social statement on trees and how my 2001 Chrysler Sebring is f***ing up the planet every time I go to work. Also if you movie buffs love the environment so much don’t see movies anymore because think about how much energy a projector uses. Poison Ivy is a week villain anyway and wouldn’t make for an interesting character study in the next movie.
I am telling you to really read our thoughts below from earlier updates this week and understand they make more of a better character study and theme laden film rather than building a social/political Batman jumping on the Wall*E bandwagon!
Update 7/22 - Dark Knight Sequel Thoughts # 2 - Ra’s al Ghul and Batman again?
So I spent sometime before the Slashfilmcast last night talking with folks about their thoughts on a sequel for The Dark Knight, many had responded well to what I had written here but I wanted to add some things I mentioned last night to this post.
Think about Batman Begins, think about the League of Shadows and how they were going through history and sacking civilizations who had met their peak. Their whole mission was to destroy Gotham City. Batman thwarted that plan due to his ability to strike fear into Gotham’s underworld with his theatrical ways.
What if the League still exists? Think about the Joker, he had No origin in the film, which I was OK with. No fingerprints, no alias, no identity of any kind. What if he was an agent of the “League”? What if the Joker was their answer to Batman. I mean it always bugged me that a person who was so anti-order and pro-anarchy had such and organized plan and ordered means to destroy the city and Batman. Who could have helped him plan such an intricate plot? The “League” perhaps.
Anyway that was another thought on what you could bring up in the sequel. Personally I like my first story better because it is more theme oriented and more of a character study continuation much like TDK was. This other idea proposed seems a little too full-circle for me. However, many people believe The Joker is Batman’s greatest nemesis and that is only because there are a lot of comparison’s between the two characters and he is the popular choice by fans but in the comics it is truly Ra’s Al Ghul who makes the greatest enemy to Batman. You could realistically bring Ra’s back with the Lazarus Pit, and no you do not make it like it is in the comics but rather like a government project known as the “Lazarus Pit” and they bring people back from “dead”. Or you divert the Ra’s character to someone new, like the Dread Pirate Roberts theory. Also if you feel keen into putting in a Love story for the film you can use this element of Batman’s opposition to Ra’s is complicated by his love for the villain’s daughter, Talia Al Ghul.
Anyway like I said this isn’t my favorite idea of a sequel but just something I have thought about. Either way I still believe you have to make a story where Batman is seen by everyone as an enemy and though he stills tries to fight injustice it is hard when people are out to get you. I think that you have to analyze that and make it to where people want him back by the end of the story.
Update 7/21 - “THE BATMAN or Batman:Redemption, a Robin Origin and a serial killer Riddler for Batman 3.
After seeing The Dark Knight in Imax this weekend I have some more thoughts on the future of the caped crusader. The next film could be called one of two things: The Batman or Batman:Redemption
MajorXero came up with the Redemption but I am a personal fan of just calling it “The Batman” - it allows you to focus this film on him completely and there is a certain kind of draw just saying The Batman. I think it also fits into what they will or should focus on in a sequel which is creating a story where the people hate Batman, where they want him brought to justice and how by the ends movie people will need Batman again.
I written this before but even more so after seeing the film…a sequel can work but they really have to come up with a villain and story that is unique. I wrote that The Riddler should be used in the next film and can be used in a realistic way. Nolan made The Dark Knight a gansta, criminal caper, heist film and gave an ode to the great films that used those formulas, Heat, Godfather 2, Bullet, French Connection, etc.
This next movie could be an ode to an even darker Batman film and even a nod to the thrillers like Seven or Silence of the Lambs. It can show Batman even more like a detective and create a scenario where people would need and want him back. The Riddler can play into that giving you a concept of a compulsed serial killer that has formidable intelligence even on Batman, you can even bring in “the Penguin” make him a successful business man that is a “gentleman” of crime, earing a tuxedo but taking over the mob slowly and using it to launder money and pay for terrorism much like Le Chif in Casino Royale.
Lastly I think that “Batman: Dark Victory”, a graphic novel that follows after “Long Halloween” would make for great source material. The movie’s plot can center on a series of murders involving Gotham police officers by a mysterious serial killer, who can be the Riddler (in the book it is The Hangman). Central to the storyline should be a mob war between Sal Maroni and this guy, “The Penguin” - because he wears a tuxedo and he should be played by Phillip Seymour Hoffman also he is like a Bugsy Malone kind of guy and doesn’t like to be called “The Penguin”. Within the terroristic crime war you lay out the origin of Robin, but you do not show him fighting crime or anything throughout the entire movie…just the implication and origin. You can also include the Joker in the film, portrayed by Johnny Depp, or somebody unknown, and have him in Arkham Asylum acting as a council to Batman to find the serial killer because it takes madness to catch madness and this is your Hannibal Lecter, Silence of the Lambs nod.
You can also bring in Selina Kyle as the daughter to Carmine Falcone and introduce her modestly as Catwoman…but that should a small or even tiny plot element. The biggest theme you could bring out in this movie and this goes back to why I like my title better is throughout the movie Batman struggles with his fear of being wrong in what he is doing, the people hating him as well as being alone and refusing to be helped by Commissioner Gordon. Then the people and Gordon have to seek Batman’s help. I even forsee at the end a Bale line, “I made a promise to may parents that I would be an incorruptible symbol, fight injustice, I made this promise….I am the Batman” or something like that. All these things can be used an incorporated into what I think would be a great follow-up to The Dark Knight. Oh yeah I think the movie should end with the Joker escaping from Arkham. This makes a perfect trilogy and then you do not have another series of Batman films for awhile.
Original Post - 6/22 - Is there room for Robin after Batman?
So over the next few weeks we at Fused Film will be looking at the Batman of old and new in preparation for the Dark Knight. Today marks the first feature story.
Recently over the past few weeks many early reviews of The Dark Knight have been flooding in and the buzz of the movie couldn’t be better…I salivate every time I think about when I will get a chance to screen the movie. With the flood of reviews also comes the flood of rumors already regarding the third film in this franchise. Will Nolan return? Will there be a Riddler? What’s the deal with Two-Face? Are we ever going to see Robin?
The last question is the focal point for this article. My guess is that we will never see Robin ever in Nolan’s Bat-verse…he has mentioned that many a time in interviews saying something like, the character of Robin is a young kid that Bruce Wayne reaches out too…Wayne is older at this point and probably needs a side-kick but in the universe that Nolan has created Batman is new and getting his start, Gotham’s jolt into a villain frenzy city is new…all this is new and Robin just has no place.
According to StarPulse, Christian Bale not only considers Robin lame but that he would personally go on strike if they have him in the movies…
“If Robin crops up in one of the new Batman films, I’ll be chaining myself up somewhere and refusing to go to work.”
I think that this is hilarious and I would do the same thing. Robin isn’t a bad character and fits in the comics just fine and worked with the campy Batman series with Burt Ward but in a realistic world, the one like Nolan has built to show Batman, bringing in a “Robin” would just not work not because you couldn’t write him in there are a lot of creative ways you could build Robin in but it would simply take the focus off of Batman ans what he is all about and Nolan wouldn’t do that.
